At least numbers is happy, we got that going for us.

http://brucesterling.tumblr.com/post/155311705493

I'm still bored of Trump

*facepalm*

Here. Let me be constructive:

Bernie Sanders x Killer Mike Interview #FeelTheBern || Moorish World News

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eJjQWaWIxCs


It's really a lovely interview about policy and philosophy.

Ahh.... Is he he going to be president of the United States?

When are you going to stop pretending if you ignore this it will go away?

Annnnnd the person who should watch the link isn't going to watch it and will keep being Trump's media wing.

Edit: the link isn't really about Bernie. It's about progressive activism.

Which may have some real word effect in 2 years.

And this is about intelligent people to discus not trying to change hearts and minds..unless you are a media talking head or a writer for a major news paper.

Knock yourselves out

Before the election I thought you had a valid point. Now you're just in denial.

Even then how would talking about an major party candidate for president of the US on a multinational forum the size of SE mean anything?

"The one who shall not be named"

No. you're right. Posting pictures of Trump as voltimore is exactly what the democrats need. I was wrong.

Still don't get it do you..Democrats...that's over. This is about the America Democracy and the press we so desperately need.

The pic was a jab at you for insinuating it gave him power if we discussed him.

/facepalm

Ignoring Trump was a valid strategy early in the primaries. By addressing him we lent validity to his crazy talk; after all, if there weren't something to it, why would we give it the time of day? We gave him so much free exposure that now people cite his lack of campaign spending as proof of his popularity, even if that's not an accurate reflection of what happened.

Now that he's taking office, the opposite approach is necessary. Give him all the attention he can handle and more. Don't ignore his tweets. Address every last one of them and rip them to shreds. His mouth pieces on the news? I know these women. I debated these women in Lincoln-Douglas. Their tactics don't hold up when you ask them for specific examples, concrete definitions, and explanations of what they mean and how it's supposed to work. When they act like you're being a bully, don't cave to their emotional appeals. It's the only way to wipe those smug, shit-eating smiles off their faces.

That he keeps using attractive debate women as his reps is, in and of itself, telling. The intent is to distract and hypnotize, and if that fails, force you to be "mean" to a nice pretty lady so people think you're a jerk. The best people to take them to task are the women in our party.

i think we need you in the press.

I'll take my downmod happily, thank you.

Huh. I had the same reaction to a recent post of just a YouTube trailer for a movie that came out last year.

Well I think you're asking me to post Godzilla movies every 2 to three days and I might do that every time I see a trump post here that just whines about trump w/o doing anything.

A post highlighting a particular issue about our soon-to-be president isn't 'whining'. The question about how the press deals with an entirely new paradigm is perfectly valid, especially as we step into a new, unprecedented age of disinformation and opacity in white house/press relations.
Now I wouldn't necessarily go straight to nakedly partisan sources like MSNBC, but the issues themselves are important.

But yet the hour long conversation I posted about progressive causes that Killer Mike and Bernie were talking about is "denial". I never really thought Bernie had a chance- but he certainly had a popular and growing narrative and he caught interest of many different swaths of people.

The reason I posted it is because the things they are talking about there are even MOrE important now that Trump is in office. It's about feet on the street and making positive local changes and getting out the vote- because when people vote democrats win. But the important thing is NOT a democrat winning but policies that most Americans all similarly agree on.

That's the thing. There are major issues Americans agree on. Especially, I think, ones that DON'T vote. If you get get policies like that out there, that will draw out more voters. Things like minimium wage and things like getting big money out of politics. Those are issues that draw out voters.

Yes- resistance is good, but it's a short term goal because they don't have a congressional majority. That's why I don't give a fuck. The republicans have the SCOTUS, they have congress, they have the presidency. The best thing democrats can do is split republicans (Obama is working in that with his Russian positioning) but the democrats need to get people out to vote. Talking about trump won't do that. Hilary was proof enough. The democrats need to make something. That's why Obama did so well. He talked about positivity and hope and what we could achieve. His fault was being a bit naive about big money and politics. He's not really a ruthless guy.

I don't want Bernie to be president, but I do want him to be a spokesman for progressive causes. He never would have been so popular if the democrats had a better party platform that appealed to more people. The democrats are going to have to start fighting again on the ground and progressive causes are the way to do that IMHO.

The 'denial' part was more about your dismissal of news about Trump as somehow giving him free coverage, as though he's still running for president. I'm all for promoting positive progressive policies and politicians, but in the meantime it's also important to keep on top of the present-day situation.

Bernie practically wrote the Dem platform, including minimun wage hike, which didn't seem to draw out those voters.

I was, in terms of his polling numbers. He just started too late. In this case I think the issue was the messenger.

If by "messenger" you mean the press, then you're right.

As Illustrated by a six minute MSNBC video and a plethora of Trump related links.

Seriously though at the very least can you guys mark this as politics?

It is not politics it seems you and Trump both have a hard realizing the elections is over.

Well to be fair, it's still considered politics. The term doesn't apply only to political campaigning.

This is about the media...Trump is going to be president. The politics is over at least for while. It will start again the day he takes office.

This is American politics (and the American media). If you think politics is just something that happens at elections then that's part of the problem.

This is about American media...for lack of a better word... NEWS. There is no News category curiously...And it is a shame you don't realize it importance to a Democracy.

It's politics, dude. That's not a judgement on how important is.

Also, try to see past your own myopia. America talks big, but it is not capital d Democracy. Especially with regard to presidential elections.

It is about the press...

“Were it left to me to decide whether we should have a government without newspapers, or newspapers without a government, I should not hesitate a moment to prefer the latter. But I should mean that every man should receive those papers and be capable of reading them.”

It's about the American press reporting on a politics. And that quote is from a politician talking about the importance of the free press in politics.

And you can't see the difference?

It's political. This is politics. Governance, democracy, presidents, elections, citizenship: all political concepts.

Look, I know 'politics' has come to mean something negative in the US. And everyone wants to avoid being 'political'. But if you want to make any progress you need to reach out and snatch it back. Politics is important. And almost everything has a political dimension. You can't divorce issues of media reporting on politicians from the political process and forces. And trying to just ends up wasting everybody's time. How much time have you spent trying to convince people that this is 'above' politics? How much of that time would have been better spent addressing the political issues your country and press face?

Look, I know 'politics' has come to mean something negative in the US.

Not to me it doesn't...politics if done correctly is what give the people power. Everything has some political component to it, if more than two people are involved...doesn't make everything we go politics.

This entire post is about can the news media accurately inform the populace. It is a valid and necessary part of our way of governing but it is not politics in fact if done correct it is apolitical.and bipartisan.

The SCOTUS has some politics involved in it but it is not a political body. I am no naive enough to relive that there is politics in the Press or in The SCOTUS but that is not what they do.

"it's not politics ... it's apolitical and bipartisan"

I think we have the nub of the problem. Bipartisanship is political. The idea that 'politics' is about taking sides is a very US thing. It's not how it's conceived of everywhere else. Politics is about the process and systems of governance. How nations make choices about the future, that sort of thing. How the press reports on politicians is very much part of that - even though it should be objective (or at least have it's bias openly stated) and even handed.

Let me try another tack..if this was about Trump it would be politics ...it is about the Washington post, the New York Times, ABC , Face book...it is about media.

More Jimmy Carter posts please.

This post is about the press not politics...but. I assume you were talking about Pres Carter saying that Obama should recognize Palestine before he leaves office. I agree we should talk more about it is an interesting idea.

This isn't about Carter but you won't like it any better.

Obama Can and Should Put Merrick Garland on the Supreme Court
The outgoing president has one final trump card—and he should play it.
By David Dayen
November 16, 2016

Seriously? The video is about getting out the vote and what it means to be progressive and helping to create a grass roots movement.

I actually posted it more about Killer Mike than about Bernie. Killer Mike is a political activist.

I get that Bernie didn't beat Hilary and Trump is president. But I also get that Trump knows exactly how to play the media.

But I also get that Trump knows exactly how to play the media.

That is what this post is about.

Ironically so, yes.

It's about media resistance to Trump's game, even if it is probably futile.

Sure. I get that. But beyond that, to what end. That's kind of what I'm getting at. The reason we have a trump is because Hilary's vision didn't get enough people to vote. Democrats historically win when people come out to vote. People, democrats, need something to vote for. Republicans are the ines that gain advantage by splitting people and groups (no offense numbers). Hilary was alluding to that. That's mostly what the Killer Mike/Bernie video was about. I understand it's pre election when he was running but the interesting part is Killer Mike's take. His "The View" interview was amazing too. He broke down a lot of solid points down really well and kind of cut through the "gotcha" style questions. Bernie was good at that too- structurally speaking.

That shit don't matter anymore. This is not politics!!!

This is about governing and we need a free and well informed citizenry to make That work. This is as much about where we get our news from as anything else. Social Media is about to take over from media outlets as the dominate source of news. This not about last years election it is about the next 4 years.

Governance is politics, though.

And being informed isn't the issue. Trump's awfulness was well documented. The vast majority of Americans just didn't care enough to bother voting. They knew about the Pussy grabbing, the charity fraud, the racism, and they collectively shrugged and went back to whatever else they were doing (I fully exclude from this those who wanted to vote but were prevented). Trump's actual support was pretty low (lower than Romney, even) and those people knew what they wanted. But the vast vast majority of your countrymen knew it was going to be either Clinton or Trump and they just didn't care. This is your country. This is your political problem.

"Establishment of policies, and continuous monitoring of their proper implementation, by the members of the governing body of an organization. It includes the mechanisms required to balance the powers of the members (with the associated accountability), and their primary duty of enhancing the prosperity and viability of the organization. See also corporate governance."

Politics is how you get there Governance is what you do once you do.

"And being informed isn't the issue"

It is the only issue we are talking about the press.

"Trump's awfulness was well documented."

Depends who you ask.''

About Half of Trump’s Voters Really Think Clinton Is Involved in Pedophilia Ring

"We've reached a dangerous point in our politics where people are divided not just by different political ideologies, but also by their belief in reality."

Forty percent of Trump fans also believe that Hillary Clinton lost the popular vote, despite her margin over Trump exceeding 2.7 million votes. An even greater percentage – 60 percent – think “millions” of people illegally cast their ballots for the former Secretary of State.

Do you believe there were weapons of mass destruction in Iraq that the U.S. never found?

53% YES / 47% NO

Do you believe that vaccines cause autism?

31% YES / 69% NO

Leaked email from some of Hillary Clinton’s campaign staffers contained code words for pedophilia, human trafficking, and satanic ritual abuse — some people refer to as “Pizzagate.”

Clinton voters: 17% TRUE / 82% UNTRUE

Trump Voters: 46% TRUE / 53% UNTRUE

President Obama was born in Kenya:

Clinton: 11% TRUE / 89% UNTRUE

Trump: 52% TRUE / 48% UNTRUE

Millions of illegal votes were cast in the 2016 election:

Clinton: 25% TRUE / 75% UNTRUE

Trump: 62% TRUE 38% / UNTRUE

Vaccines have been shown to cause autism:

Clinton: 18% TRUE / 81% UNTRUE
Trump: 31% TRUE / 69% UNTRUE

The U.S. government helped plan the 9/11 attacks:

Clinton: 17% TRUE / 83% UNTRUE

Trump: 15% TRUE / 85% UNTRUE

Russia tampered with vote tallies to help Donald Trump:

Clinton: 50% TRUE / 50% UNTRUE

Trump: 9% TRUE / 92% UNTRU


Well informed you say.

Oh, man. Looks like I said 'well informed' and then went back and edited it out and then hacked SE to make it look like I never edited my comment and you were putting up a straw man argument.

You're stats here fail to demonstrate that people didn't know about the pussy grabbing, or the racism, or grossness of Trump. And that's my point, people did know. They just didn't care.

And it's no good quoting stats from Trump supporters about Clinton. Those people are a minority of the electorate. The people who I take issue with are the ones who didn't vote at all. Those people knew about Trump, they knew what he was, and they weren't bothered by it. Trump was widely quoted and followed by all the media. It was all Trump all the time even out here and his own words show him as he is. And America is fine with it. It was Clinton or Trump and a huge majority of US citizens just went 'meh'. You can't win by making those people more informed. Lack of information is not their issue.

"You can't win by making those people more informed. Lack of information is not their issue."

It certainly wasn't a lack of information...They had plenty of information. It was coming in waves...but it wasn't coming from the media....and what was coming from media sources was discounted as fast as it could be written.

"Grabing Pussy" that was a joke...just a story from a long time ago.

Did you hear about the Pizza place?

This is about the media and their inability to be heard or believed About after Trump gains power the job will get tougher and they suck at it already.

Like I said I want to talk about the future but if you wonder why those people didn't vote didn't you hear Clinton help start ISIS, I even heard they had somebody killed. who would vote for somebody like that?

For those of you who missed it this was the topic of meet the Press this week as well.

Meet the Press - Jan. 1, 2017

There's been a lot of press circle-jerks lately over their fucked-up election coverage. They've been aware, and do nothing to fix it. The broadcast media especially is doing what the owners want. If they wanted real reporting, then Chuck Todd wouldn't be host of Meet The Press.