The Appeal -
podcast hosted by Adam Johnson, is where we take a deeper look at the most important criminal justice stories of the week.
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Saturday, 17 February 2018
quote [ Google’s firing of an engineer over his controversial memo criticizing its diversity policies and “politically correct monoculture” didn’t violate U.S. labor law, a federal agency lawyer concluded. ]
Another memo to screw
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donnie said @ 3:51am GMT on 19th February
[1] "Anyone" "Women". Trust me, I've had my fair share of male interns who didn't start coding until university and they were shit. The gap in performance is massive. That was my point - if you want more women to program we need to be thinking about the long game; long before they show up (or don't) with resumes.
[2] Police don't need to be marksmen (or women). A cop that can hit three out of ten shots is not really any better or worse at being a cop than a cop who is a sniper with their pistol. Programming is different. A mediocre developer can easily be ten, twenty, a hundred times, or even infinitely less productive than a very good developer. I've seen - same problem; one dev will crack it elegantly in a week, sometimes another would take six months to figure it out or just give up altogether.
[3] Except that in NONE of your explanations do you admit or even speak to the rampant sexism that has existed in these fields.
The point is that it's irrelevant in the context of Google's hiring process - the damage has already been done when they're staring at 98 male applications and two women for a single job. My point is that, whatever problems exist, they are not caused by Google hiring based on merit (and hiring women disproportionate to the applicant pool, ergo, will not fix the problem). If there is sexism in the pipeline that carries children through to dropping off resumes at Google then the solution to the problem is there, not at the HR desk.
[4] If there's only 2 women programmers in the world, Google isn't "hurting everyone else" by hiring both of them.
Well, if we're proceeding from the notion that all workplaces would benefit from having a better gender balance then, yes, they are hurting in the sense that, outside the Google utopia, they've just driven down the gender balance at every other workplace (thereby sweeping "the problem" out to other workplaces to continue to fester).
donnie said @ 3:51am GMT on 19th February
[1] "Anyone" != "Women". Trust me, I've had my fair share of male interns who didn't start coding until university and they were shit. The gap in performance is massive. That was my point - if you want more women to program we need to be thinking about the long game; long before they show up (or don't) with resumes.
[2] Police don't need to be marksmen (or women). A cop that can hit three out of ten shots is not really any better or worse at being a cop than a cop who is a sniper with their pistol. Programming is different. A mediocre developer can easily be ten, twenty, a hundred times, or even infinitely less productive than a very good developer. I've seen - same problem; one dev will crack it elegantly in a week, sometimes another would take six months to figure it out or just give up altogether.
[3] Except that in NONE of your explanations do you admit or even speak to the rampant sexism that has existed in these fields.
The point is that it's irrelevant in the context of Google's hiring process - the damage has already been done when they're staring at 98 male applications and two women for a single job. My point is that, whatever problems exist, they are not caused by Google hiring based on merit (and hiring women disproportionate to the applicant pool, ergo, will not fix the problem). If there is sexism in the pipeline that carries children through to dropping off resumes at Google then the solution to the problem is there, not at the HR desk.
[4] If there's only 2 women programmers in the world, Google isn't "hurting everyone else" by hiring both of them.
Well, if we're proceeding from the notion that all workplaces would benefit from having a better gender balance then, yes, they are hurting in the sense that, outside the Google utopia, they've just driven down the gender balance at every other workplace (thereby sweeping "the problem" out to other workplaces to continue to fester).
<-- Entry / Current Comment
donnie said @ 3:51am GMT on 19th February
[1] "Anyone" != "Women". Trust me, I've had my fair share of male interns who didn't start coding until university and they were shit. The gap in performance is massive. That was my point - if you want more women to program we need to be thinking about the long game; long before they show up (or don't) with resumes.
[2] Police don't need to be marksmen (or women). A cop that can hit three out of ten shots is not really any better or worse at being a cop than a cop who is a sniper with their pistol. Programming is different. A mediocre developer can easily be ten, twenty, a hundred times, or even infinitely less productive than a very good developer. I've seen - same problem; one dev will crack it elegantly in a week, sometimes another would take six months to figure it out or just give up altogether.
[3] Except that in NONE of your explanations do you admit or even speak to the rampant sexism that has existed in these fields.
The point is that it's irrelevant in the context of Google's hiring process - the damage has already been done when they're staring at 98 male applications and two women for a single job. My point is that, whatever problems exist, they are not caused by Google hiring based on merit (and hiring women disproportionate to the applicant pool, ergo, will not fix the problem). If there is sexism in the pipeline that carries children through to dropping off resumes at Google then the solution to the problem is there, not at the HR desk.
[4] If there's only 2 women programmers in the world, Google isn't "hurting everyone else" by hiring both of them.
Well, if we're proceeding from the notion that all workplaces would benefit from having a better gender balance then, yes, they are hurting in the sense that, outside the Google utopia, they've just driven down the gender balance at every other workplace (thereby sweeping "the problem" out to other workplaces to continue to fester).
